SquidBusters Archive - Rear spring swap and Hyperpro opinions?

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Rear spring swap and Hyperpro opinions?
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Posted by: Wingspan

Anyone here have experience swapping rear springs? I'm looking at re-springing my VFR. Seems simple enough, if you've got a spring compressor. Just wondering if anyone here has done it and what compression tools you used. There are a few varieties on the market. The fork springs will be upgraded as well, fwiw.

Also, general thoughts/experiences with the Hyperpro progressive springs would also be appreciated. I know this isn't a perfect handling solution but I'm not looking for track perfection, only an improvement for street riding. I like the idea of the progressive spring because the load carried by the VFR varies wildly since it's used for solo, 2-up, and riding with packed luggage. Obviously, an aftermarket shock would be the best solution but the VFR is getting up there in years and so the pickings are slim. Also, I really don't want to sink that much $$$ into an old bike.

Posted by: Oxi-Rider

I have never replaced the spring on a shock, no help there. The triumph sprint had progressive springs. I was not a fan. Mostly, I wasn't a fan of fork springs that are progressive. They tended to make highway riding smoother over very small surface imperfections. But, they have their limitations as well. The soft rate that soaked up those minute bumps also took up a considerable amount of the spring length. So, with very little force from braking , the front end would dive horribly. Over a more squared off hole in the ground, the fork would almost bottom out, because it would slam through the soft portion of the spring rate very fast, jamming the front tire upwards. On any type of hard cornering, I would feel the travel of the forks shortened, leaving only the higher, harsher rate of the spring left. This meant a very firm, harsh ride on tiwsties at any speed.

I am sure i could have had some of these characteristics t uned out with some better damping qualities from better valving, but I was quite turned off by the variable rate springs.

Posted by: 87hurricane

I have no experience with Progressive springs, but the idea seems well suited for basic street riding. As for the spring compressor, I'd have a hard time fork out cash for something I was only going to use maybe 3-4 times in my life. Motorcycles springs are that big or strong, I'm sure you could rig something up that would work just fine. Other option would be to simply take it into the local bike shop and pay them a couple bucks to do it for you.

Posted by: Falcn

$37 for one tool.

http://www.psep.biz/store/suspension_tools.htm

$99 for one from racetech:
http://www.racetech.com/shopping/sh...ring+Compressor

interesting link with some pictures and a section on removing the shock springs - showing a tool in action. Some shocks don't need a tool as you can completely remove the preload rings.

http://books.google.com/books?id=S5...0#PRA1-PA120,M1

Smaller type like the automotive ones specifically for motorcycles: $25

http://item.express.ebay.com/_Autom...cmdZExpressItem

Posted by: 87hurricane

Wow, thats surprisingly cheap. I knew it was a really simple setup, but I just assumed they'd want a fortune for something like that.

Posted by: Falcn

Added a couple more. The one from ebay - search on motorcycle spring compressor - doesn't look too bad.

Posted by: natrona848

i never did it myself but i did get a proper weight hyperpro spring for my 03' 6R since the stocker was way to stiff. what a difference! mostly i think it was due to it being the right rate so i'm not sure how much i really like the progressive action but the handling did improve a greatly.

don't know if that helps or not.

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falcn

Added a couple more. The one from ebay - search on motorcycle spring compressor - doesn't look too bad.

That is one I had already seen. I was hoping someone had used it.

Posted by: crammer

what size do you need? i'm not using 500 that i'll sell ya.

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by crammer

what size do you need? i'm not using 500 that i'll sell ya.

If I'm not mistaken, that's much lighter than what's already on the bike. Thanks for the offer, though.

Posted by: Wondertwin

I'd try to see if you can remove it without a tool first. I actually did the wife's Jetta without a tool (or even imprrovising anything), and it's fundamentally the same operation. You could also improvise fairly easily with a buddy to help. I've used chain or cable and a floor jack (loop the chain under the frame of the jack, attach to the spring, and set the mounting eye on the jacking platform) to compress a spring pretty well. You'd want to have a buddy to stabilize it and not crank it down any more than it takes to get the adjustment collars off. I'm sure there's other ways around buying a tool as well. Figuring it out might help cut down on some useless TV watching time!

For front springs, I can vouch for Sonic Springs. They've worked very well on my Bandit.

Quote:

Also, I really don't want to sink that much $$$ into an old bike.

Anyone want to take bets it would outlast his Mille?

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondertwin

Anyone want to take bets it would outlast his Mille?

Not unless I start treating it better than I did last summer...

Posted by: VonKujo

When I did mine I could not find a compression tool that had small enough teeth to fit between the small coils. I had to take it to the dealer and have them compress the spring and replace it. I just removed the shock and took it to them. If you find a tool that fits and works well please let me know because I will purchase one.

Posted by: Wondertwin

Quote:

Not unless I start treating it better than I did last summer...

Or riding it less than the Mille for that matter!

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondertwin

Or riding it less than the Mille for that matter!

If I don't fix the suspension, it will see less duty than the Mille.

I've been looking around and I can have a Wilbers shock made for less than $600. Depending on my tax return, that may be an option. I'm liking the idea of respringing the stock shock less and less. I've considered a CBR900 or 929 shock, but by the time I purchase a shock and have it rebuild/resprung I will have spent almost as much as an aftermarket. I'd have to fabricate a new upper shock mount as well because the CBR shocks are ~40mm shorter than stock.

Posted by: Falcn

less than $600 is a deal - especially if you can add options to it later - like a remote reservoir and remote hydraulic preload adjustment.

You can have them rebuilt easier than stock shocks too.

Posted by: BlackB12

I had a wilbers shock on my FJR. Very nice stuff there. It came with it installed and I thought it handled OK, then I put the stock one back on to sell it and it really showed how nice the Wilbers was.

Mike

Posted by: Falcn

I hope Penske shocks gets their new website up soon...

Posted by: Wondertwin

Why not pull the shock off and we'll play with it a little bit before you order a $600 new one. Maybe that spring isn't so hard to get off of there.

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondertwin

Why not pull the shock off and we'll play with it a little bit before you order a $600 new one. Maybe that spring isn't so hard to get off of there.

I'm just looking at options right now. I'm not set on a new shock yet.

Posted by: Wingspan

The UPS man paid me a visit today!

I decided to try the Hyperpro rear spring. I also ordered a set of Sonic Springs for the fork and some tapered roller steering stem bearings from All Balls racing. I hope to get some work done on the install this weekend but with the weather we've been having there isn't any big rush. I know the valving won't be ideal for the springs I've ordered, but I'm hoping to get a decent improvement over what I've got now. 95% of the VFR's duties are interstate and commuting, so a perfect suspension isn't really required. Time will tell how it works out and I can always revalve the forks later if necessary.

FWIW, I was pleased with Hyperpro's service. They answered my questions very quickly via email and the spring arrived at my door 4 days after I ordered. Kudos also go to Sonic Springs, who shipped almost as quickly and sent me 2 different emails after I ordered letting me know that my order was received and later that it had shipped.

My only complaint so far is that wretched purple color Hyperpro puts on their springs. Good thing the rear shock isn't very visible on the VFR.

Posted by: natrona848

yeah, i wasn't happy with the purple either

Posted by: Wingspan

GRRRR....@##%$####$$##$%%$#$%#%$##%#$#$###

Started the suspension work on the VFR today. I pulled the fork legs and triple, then set about replacing the steering head bearings. No problems there. The job went a lot faster than the last time I did it (on my TLR). The stock bearings were in pretty bad shape. Dry as a bone and about as loose as it gets. I actually removed the retaining nuts by hand, they weren't even finger tight. Then I moved on to the fork springs.

The first fork leg went smooth. New spring and oil in. The fun started on the second leg.

This fork leg suffered what I thought was a cosmetic scrape when I crashed the bike last April. Well, I was wrong about that. Apparently the scraped area is actually a dent and is pressing on the inner leg. It's nearly impossible to cycle the fork through its full travel by hand, even with no spring in it. There are two or three distinct tight spots. So, it looks like the bike is parked until I can source another right fork leg. I think I'm going to look for a complete leg, rather than trying to piece one together.

Ebay, here I come.

Posted by: Falcn

That sucks.

Posted by: natrona848

crappy

Posted by: garry

FWIW, I put a HyperPro "combi kit" on my Sprint RS and thought it was money well spent ($250). I also swapped the rear spring on my Wee Strom for a Wilbers spring and that was money well spent too ($106). In both cases I removed the shock from the bike and just took it to a local dealer to have them swap the spring. Got charged for a half hour of labor each time.

Posted by: Wondertwin

Quote:

This happened on a CBR900RR I used to have. I bought it wrecked, and when putting new fork seals in, I discovered the same thing that you're experiencing. My solution was to take the leg to a friend's machine shop and have the dents (or internal high spots, depending on your perspective) bored-out. Worked like a charm!

Then again, you might find one for that bike pretty cheaply on eBay... Hey, maybe a CBR600F3 front-end will fit on it if you want to get crazy and have more adjustability!

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondertwin

Then again, you might find one for that bike pretty cheaply on eBay...

Indeed, ebay comes through again. I've got an entire fork and triples on it's way. More parts than I need, but I'll either have more spares or can part out what I don't use on ebay and make some of the cash back.

Posted by: Wondertwin

Awesome!

Posted by: RupturedDust

Nice!

Posted by: Wingspan

My spring compressor arrived so I swapped the rear spring this afternoon. It's very easy to do with the proper tool.

I used the compressor Progressive sells as being for the Goldwing. If anyone is in the market for a tool like this, I highly recommend buying the Goldwing tool over their standard compressor. The difference is the bolt/clevis method of attachment to the shock eye and the addition of the aluminum collar. The standard tool does not have the collar and has just a metal hook to snag the shock eye with. Note: I had to trim one end of the collar ~1/4" to clear the preload adjuster on the VFR shock.

Tool installed on the shock:

There is a set screw on this particular shock that must be loosened before you can compress the spring. It's only function is to keep the preload adjuster from rotating around the shock body. You can see it to the right of this pic. Once the set screw is backed off, compress the spring until a metal retaining ring becomes visible. Remove the ring, then backoff the compressor to remove the spring. Reverse the process to install the new spring,

Note set screw on right side of pic and snap ring in groove:

Job done, shock ready to reinstall:

I haven't ridden it yet but even just sitting on it feels like a different bike. The sag is now where it should be and that's a huge change in itself. I had something like 3 inches of sag with the stock spring. Only time will tell if the stock damping can keep up with the new spring. I'm sure it won't be perfect but 90% of this bike's duties involve long interstate runs and commuting so that last degree of perfection really isn't required. Stay tuned!

Posted by: Falcn

Nice tool. Good job on the shock change! We're waiting anxiously for the ride report.

Posted by: VonKujo

Is that tool specific to your style of shock? I don't think that would work on my FZ1 Shock. Do you have any other pictures of the disassembly?

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonKujo

Is that tool specific to your style of shock? I don't think that would work on my FZ1 Shock. Do you have any other pictures of the disassembly?

The tool is not specific. Sorry, these are the only pics I took.

There are a few different ways to remove the spring on shocks. I think the FZ1 has retention plates on the bottom end of the shock instead of removing the preload adjuster.

Posted by: VonKujo

Correct. On my FZ you have to compress the spring and then remove the retention plate. The spring then slides off the bottom of the shock.

Posted by: Wingspan

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonKujo

Correct. On my FZ you have to compress the spring and then remove the retention plate. The spring then slides off the bottom of the shock.

I see no reason why this tool wouldn't work then. You wouldn't need to use the aluminum collar though.

Posted by: natrona848

good deal mark.

Posted by: Wingspan

GRRRRRR.... got my replacement forks in the mail today. The ad said "everything appears to be straight". Well...

Sure looks straight to me?!?!

Of course, these pics would have to be of the right fork leg which is the one I needed. It does appear that the left leg is straight, so I think I can swap the inner tube between the two to build one good leg. Maybe all is not lost, but I'm not a happy camper.

Posted by: Wingspan

Update:

Spent some time in the garage and was able to successfully swap the inner tubes and come up with a good set of forks for the bike. It's now all back together with the Hyperpro rear spring, SonicSprings in the fork, and All Balls Racing tapered steering head bearings. Now I just need some decent weather to actually ride the thing.

It'll be interesting to see how good or bad the damping is, but at least now I can get the sag where I want it.

Posted by: Wondertwin

I just realized that I have a Progressive Suspension shock spring compressor out in the garage. Duh...

Posted by: Wingspan

Isn't it great when you find tools you forgot about? It's like getting a new toy all over again!